The totalitarian regime in 1984 used torture as a way of governing. Most clearly, torture was a way to govern domestic enemies of the state. Those captured by the Thought Police were shocked and beaten and, worst of all, their individual fears were used against them--Winston's fear of rats lead to the torturer putting two hungry and aggressive rats in a cage that was designed to strap over his face, for instance.
In our own time, it has become public knowledge that the US government has authorized the use of a number of controversial techniques in the current war. The most well known is described in the quote below:
Waterboarding
Finally, you would like to use a technique called the "waterboard" in this procedure, the individual is bound securely to an inclined bench, which is approximately four feet by seven feet.
The individual's feet are generally elevated. A cloth is placed over the forehead and eyes. Water is then applied to the cloth in a controlled manner. As this is done, the cloth is lowered until it covers both the nose and mouth. Once the cloth is saturated and completely covers the mouth and nose, air flow is slightly restricted for 20 to 40 seconds due to the presence of the cloth. This causes an increase in carbon dioxide level in the individual's blood. This increase in the carbon dioxide level stimulates increased effort to breathe. This effort plus the cloth produces the perception of suffocation and incipient panic," i.e., the perception of drowning.
The individual does not breathe any water into his lungs. During those 20 to 40 seconds, water is continuously applied from a height of twelve to twenty-four inches. After this period, the cloth is lifted, and the individual is allowed to breathe unimpeded for three or four full breaths. The sensation of drowning is immediately relieved by the removal of the cloth. The procedure may then be repeated. The water is usually applied from a canteen cup or small watering can with a spout.
[For more info on this see here, here, and here for more info]
Waterboarding is a technique of government that dates back to the 14th century.
A turning point for waterboarding — in any form — came around 1800. As the Enlightenment swept across Europe, many countries banned the practice and people, in general, found it "morally repugnant," Peters says. Waterboarding moved underground, but did not disappear by any means. In fact, it has experienced something of a revival in the 20th century.
The interrogation method was used by the Japanese in World War II, by U.S. troops in the Philippines and by the French in Algeria. In Cambodia, the Khmer Rogue used waterboarding against its own people. The British used it against both Arabs and Jews in occupied Palestine in the 1930s. In the 1970s, it was widely used in Latin America, particularly under the military dictatorships in Chile and Argentina (where it was known as "Asian torture.")
Is waterboarding and other controversial techniques deviations from American ideals and values? And if so, are there any circumstances under which these methods might legitimately be used by the American government? In using these techniques, are there any risks that we will undermine American ideals and values and begin to resemble those enemies that we fight against?
Japanese soldiers and officials who authorized water boarding during WWII were prosecuted by the US military and sentenced to death. Should US officials who authorized water boarding be prosecuted for war crimes for breaking US and international law? Why or why not?
Or, alternatively, were waterboarding and these other techniques legitimate tools used by agents of the government to secure American ideals and values? And if these are legitimate methods for securing ourselves against terrorists, should the US government tell its citizens that these methods are being used or should the methods be kept secret? Why should they be kept secret or made public? Which is better (secrecy or public knowledge) for our democracy and why?
I feel as if the US is being hypocritical if during WWII they prosecuted the Japanese soldiers, but now the US officials are doing the same thing. Although they may be taking suspects out of the country to secret prisons to do this, it still doesn't make it right. And I don't think they should do it and be able to get away with it. For our democracy it should be made public what the government is doing. We have the right to know what they're capable of and why they're able to do it but anyone else would be prosecuted. Again, seems very hypocritical to me.
ReplyDeleteTheoni Kontos
PSCI 100.03
I agree with Theoni. The US practices the same techniques as the Japanese. The difference is that the Japanese are not afraid to let people know what they are doing and why. Our government tries to play the good guy and the Japanese as the bad guy. The US has hidden places where they torture not only foreigners, but US citizens as well. They do not want us to know what is going on, yet we always have the feeling that we are being kept in the dark about what our nation is capable of.
ReplyDeleteIt seems that anytime a topic like this comes up some government official says "we do this to keep you safe" and the public is pacified. But at what cost are we being kept safe and are we really any safer? I don't think we are. People in other countries are a lot more knowledgeable about what goes on in our government then we do and I believe that in many cases it is our governments hypocritical policies that create enemies. The fact that most american don't really know what's going on makes it even worse. People should be informed. American is all about be democratic (supposedly) so what our government dose reflects directly on us. Maybe when ermines say Americans are evil they are sort of right. You catch more fly's with honey then with water boarding.
ReplyDeleteI feel as though waterboarding or other government tecniques are done on a necessary basis. The US uses it upon the people who obviously have either commited a harsh crime or are keeping something from us in general: such as knowledge or secrets, that would benefit us, or that we need to know.
ReplyDeleteHiding it from us is most certainly not the way to go about it, but then again we do not know everything they are dealing with as well. In the long run, maybe they are keeping information from the people in order for us to feel safer.
Laura Elkins
PSCI 100.4
there are two ways to think of this situation. The first is that by using torture methods like this one could argue that harsher punishments may prevent crime. That is is people know that water boarding is a punishment for stealing or something like that then one may be less likely to steal. On the other hand, in Ireland, all the guns have been banned, including for police - and so all the gun violence has pretty much vanished. So its really hard to say that water boarding, and other torture techniques are effective, when the gun situation in Ireland says otherwise.
ReplyDeleteYasmin Modica
PSCI 100.04
I feel that the United States is being hypocritical on the fact that during World War II they prosecuted Japanese soldiers for using water boarding, but use it in today’s current wars. To me water boarding should be used by the United States, but only in times that at is really needed. They should use it for last options against enemies. Although, many people know about the U.S using water boarding a lot of citizens still have no clue. The U.S should not keep this a secret from its people.
ReplyDeleteWayne Fleming PSCI 100.4
What some people forget is that in the first couple weeks of class we talked about how the government does what is in the interest of the government; and for those who say "they are doing it in the interest of the people" do you ever think of how you got that opinion? the news maybe? If one of the major things of America is equality we wouldn't do something we have already punished others for it is indeed hypocritical. How could they be legitimate ways to secure our ideals if they don't even fall inside the ideals themselves? Putting someone's life in danger and damaging their psyche sometimes beyond repair in my opinion is inexcusable no matter what. For the US as a democracy the best thing to do would be to make it public because we as citizens have a right to know what we are up against and have a say in the way the government takes care of it.
ReplyDeleteJessica Hall, PSCI 100.04
Hannah Hime PSCI 100.4
ReplyDeleteTechniques, such as waterboarding, are not good methods to keep down terrorists, there are other ways to do so. Even sentencing a terrorist to death is more humane that torturing an individual. If the US is using methods like this, I think the public of a true democracy should know about it, but the US hides many secrets.
Considering the U.S. signed the CONVENTION AGAINST TORTURE and Other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment along with about 50 other countries and this agreement defines torture as “any act by which severe pain or suffering, whether physical or mental, is intentionally inflicted on a person for such purposes as obtaining from him or a third person information or a confession” I would say that waterboarding and other techniques are deviations from American ideals and values. If the U.S. government enters into an agreement not to use these techniques, and then does not abide by those rules, it will undermine the trust other countries have in the U.S. We will no longer have the respect we have worked hard to cultivate throughout the world. We will be no better than our enemies who use kidnapping, holding hostages, be-headings, etc. to garner international attention.
ReplyDeleteOn the other hand, I have a hard time pronouncing whether or not U.S. officials should be prosecuted for war crimes regarding waterboarding. This isn’t a black and white issue. Clearly, there are many shades of gray. There are many other questions which would have to be answered first. Was everyone involved aware of the United Nations agreement? Did the U.S. President override this agreement and give carte blanche to military leaders? What were the exact circumstances during which these techniques took place? Were there other lives at stake? Was a nuclear bomb about to be dropped which could wipe out hundreds of thousands of lives compared to the one being waterboarded? And, the U.S. government doesn’t protect just its own citizens, it protects other countries as well. I can’t really condemn or condone without knowing the context or the facts.
Comparing WWII prosecutions and current situations with the government is impossible. We now have so many methods of extermination that probably weren’t possible during WWII (or maybe they were!) such as anthrax. I don’t believe that what happened then should set a precedent for now. These are different times, different people.
I have always lived a relatively safe life. I do not cower in fear of bombing raids, military troops taking over my house, or militant rebels taking over my bus on the way to the mall. This is due to the trust I place in the U.S. government and the permission (every time I vote) to act in my best interests when it comes to national security. I can’t possibly know what it’s like to embark from a troop ship with an automatic rifle in my hands knowing I may not go back, or head into combat in a jungle and be taken prisoner not knowing where I am and not speaking the language of my captors. So, I know nothing of the real terror of war and fighting. I know nothing of the anguish of military leaders who are trying to decide the best course to protect us. Maybe it’s better when we don’t know to what extremes our government goes to in order to protect and provide safety. Right now, I am not sure which way is right.
Dee Pierce
PSCI 100.03
I think water boarding is not the best way to ward off any terrorist from attacking our country. It is first of hypocritical (as said above) because we play it off like we don't do it and thats cruel but in actuality we do use that technique to ward of terrorists. The US hides many secrets and they may be doing that for our "benefit" but I do not see the benefit in water boarding.
ReplyDeleteStephanie Hudlow
PSCI 100.05
If the Americans prosecuted the Japanese for authorizing water boarding during World War II, then why should the American government think that it is alright for our government to do it now? It seems to be extremely hypocritical on the American government's part. The fact that the American government is keeping these horrendous acts from the public eye probably means that it isn't the right thing to do. I feel as if these techniques that the American government uses against our "enemies" definitely does go against our values. America constantly promotes peace, yet we never seem to set a good example for it. These techniques are just another way of showing that. I believe that there are other ways to secure our ideals and values, rather than inhumane acts of torture. Rather than being like the countries with the immoral and inhumane values, America needs to be the country that it constantly promotes that it is.
ReplyDeleteKelly Sweeney
ReplyDeletePSCI 100.05
I believe there has to be a more effective way of getting information out of enemies then waterboarding. I feel this is a cruel punishment that can be avoided with other techniques. As for whether the government should let us know, I say yes. I feel that the government should inform its citizens of everything that goes on because the government doesn't want citizens doing things in secret. I do believe US officials should be punished for breaking US and International law because this is clearly going against the law. These officials should not be treated any differently than the average American when it comes to being punished for breaking the law.
ReplyDeleteBrandi Parsons
PSCI 100.04
I think government keeps knowledge of these torchure methods quiet because they are afraid people will try and stop their use if it was commonly known. People generally don't want to harm others, even if they have information that we need to know. There are better ways to try and figure this kind of information out. Making people have the sensation and fear that they are drowning is cruel and we noticed that when we sentanced people to death for waterboarding back in WWII. This obviously makes the U.S. hypocritical, even though they bring it outside of the country's boundaries. This type of activity should end.
ReplyDeleteKindra Bittle
PSCI 100.03
I agree with some of the earlier comments the U.S is very hypocritical. We say that we want peace and not war. If we have to go to war than its for a good cause. When you learn about some of the techniques they used such as waterboarding it is ridiculous. I understand that it is used for different reasons like, to get information out of them, to scare others,etc. Is it really necessary though? To terrorize someone to the point where they can not breathe is very inhumane. The US is not better than anyone else in the world. We just tend to get involved in larger situations which make us look bad because we have that thrill for gaining power.
ReplyDeleteKatelyn Sine
100.04
I agree completely with Katelyn. Especially the "peace not war" comment. Actions speak louder than words. I don't have much to say about the US and their methods of using this procedure, besides that I am 99.9% completely against it. No matter what the situation is or the circumstances the US faces with enemies or anything, no one deserves that kind of torture. The US should not have that power over treating another human being like that.
ReplyDelete100.4
Torture of another being is never acceptable.It is outrageous that the United States utilizes inhumane tactics in the name of security. America is quick to interfere if other countries participate in acts that infringe upon human rights and human dignities. These hypocritical actions certainly tarnish the image of justice and righteousness that our government trys to display within and outside our borders. And besides how effective is torture anyhow when you are talking about terroists. My understanding is that suffering and death is the expected and noble outcome of terroist actions anyhow. These people willingly explode themselves in the name of "God" and their ideas of justice. If anything, these people may even be exhalted within their groups or country and it is the Americans that really look like the terroists.
ReplyDelete100.04
To see that this kind of torture is being used by the United States forces is incredible to me. It even seems as though we are quite hypocritcal. We have persecuted others on these accounts before in US history but how is it right for our people to be doing such a thing? I believe that torture in this form is not acceptable. I do find it very interesting how once someone is under torture they will tell you what you want to hear. Although it's not the ethical way of going about business. Things can be solved in different ways. By seeing Americans act hypocritically towards this torture issue it makes us look very foolish and it is quite embarassing to know that this is going on in our own country.
ReplyDeleteHanna Simane
100.05
The U.S. does indeed seem to be very hypocritical. Like everyone else has said, from WWII, to persecute them for waterboarding yet we do it as well. It is inhumane to do to someone whom you are uncertain of great wrong doing, but not so much if we know they have killed innocent people or planned too. It would't be right to punish the people who have done the waterboarding within the U.S., enless they were the oens that executed the order. The ones that should be punished are the ones that executed the order.
ReplyDeletei think that our government carries out with torture to ensure that the united states is safe and out of harms way. that being said it is not always the right thing to do. sometimes we might accuse the wrong person. also we as americans say that torture is a horrible thing and should be punishable but we carry it out on suspicious people at our own will.
ReplyDeleteabove comment is Robert Hayes psci 100:04
ReplyDeleteI think that the US should not use techniques of tortue such as waterboarding. I think that US officials that use or authorize the use of these techniques should be subject to the national and international courts. I do not really think that they should be put to death but I do think they should be punished in a manner that fits their crime. Now im not calling for them to be tourtured or anything but they should not be able to just get away with doing this.
ReplyDeleteBen Hackett 100.03
I do believe tha if the US practing waterboarding is completely hypocritical. But, I do not believe that the US officials allowing or doing it should not be prosecuted. Since the sensation of drowning is so scarey for people, it is probably a very useful interrogation technique, and if the US did not have techniques to get our enemies to talk, we could be in even more danger. Waterboarding obviously is not as dangerous as actually causing bodily harm with weapons. Not only is it safer, but to me it is more humane, even if it is a war technique. Even though I believe the technique should be used, I do not believe US citizens should know about it. Although I belive in our democracy, the public should be informed about what is going on in our government and war, I do not feel that we should know what happens during the war. I feel that if people knew everything that happened, we would not feel as safe as we do with our army.
ReplyDeleteAshley Everts PSCI 100.04
Waterboarding is a legitimate tool used by agents of our government to secure American ideals and values. Without this technique we would not find out valuable information against our enemies. This technique ensures that our national security is not in jeopardy. Like the article said this technique has been used for centuries. What is the difference between now and then? We are all still human, by starting wars, killing each other over power, and disagreeing with other nation’s ideals. No the United States of America should not tell its citizens because they would ultimately disapprove of these actions and try to discard this technique. Although the citizens would still want to know that there government is doing everything it can so that they feel safe living in this country. The bottom line is what the public doesn’t know about the government’s action doesn’t hurt them. Secrecy is the best means of performing this technique on the enemies of our country because citizens of the U.S are busy caring about themselves then how people in other countries are being treated.
ReplyDeleteJoshua Labuhn PSCI 100.03
Katherine Martin PSCI .04
ReplyDeleteI feel that if the US prosecuted the Japanese for this, then it is completely ridiculous that the US can then turn around and do the same thing. That is a complete 'we are better than everyone else and so we can do whatever we want' attitude and its wrong. If the Japanese can't do something, then nobody else, especially the ones who condemned them, should be able to get away with doing that either. Trying to get answers is fine and all, but I am completely against torture. In my opinion, it is completely wrong. In any context, it is completely wrong and disgusting.
I feel that the US is being hypocritical in this situation , due the fact the Japanese were convicted for these same war crimes. However, water boarding and other similar tactics are a useful part of our government. These tactics help insure our safety. Its important that these are used properly and by the right people. The practice should remain private and out of public view. It is only for a measure of security and should not be abused. Without these things in place some of our acquired government knowledge may still be unknown.
ReplyDeleteI personally think that any sort of torture put forth unto soldiers from other countries by the U.S. is unacceptable. The U.S. should be avoiding looking like bullies and avoid using unusual cruel punishment. It will help destroy our already destroyed reputation from much of the outside world. I am not sure what sort of values the U.S. might think it has, but if techniques like this are being used then clearly we don't have any. Nothing should be keep secret. Secrets make American citizens ignorant to how the rest of the world views us. Secrets are kept because our government is naughty and nasty. Full knowledge of what hideous and dramatic abuse to other countries we (or "they", the government and it's soldiers) inflict during times of war would cause problems. It's best our citizens are kept indoors with a Wii or a lifetime subscription to U.S. Weekly.
ReplyDeleteI think the United States is being very hypocritical when it comes to this subject. I think that waterboarding period is awful and no one should be allowed to do it. I think that the United States is always trying to put on this image of being "the best" and knowing what to do in certain situations but by doing things such as waterboarding makes it seem like we are stooping to a different level. This reminds me of the whole Black Site delima that is going on; where the US is holding secret bases outside of the country to do such tortures as waterboarding and if it is against our laws why would we break our own laws and do it anyway? It doesnt make sense and i think the US i very hypocritical when it comes to this subject.
ReplyDeleteChristina Ferrara PSCI 100.03
It is surprising to learn what our government is/has been doing. Many people are unaware of how forceful our government is in their torture aspects. I feel that this form of torture is unacceptable. I feel that there are more humane ways to go about finding what we need to find out. Yes, most people ‘crack’ under pressure or torture, which is probably why we still use it; however, torture is violent and unnecessary. It also makes America, as a whole, look bad. As other have stated previously, the US looked bad upon the Japanese for doing the exact same torture technique, but then we turn around and do it ourselves? It makes America look very hypocritical.
ReplyDeleteEmmi Shambeda
PSCI 100.05
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI believe that waterboarding and other forms of torture, although effective in deriving intel from prisoners, is an inhumane way of getting this information. People may say that it is not dangerous, but I'm sure there have been deaths caused by these techniques; we probably just do not hear about them because the government keeps that information from us "to protect us." I don't believe that we are being protected by not hearing of those things, but that's a completely different topic.
ReplyDeleteThe Preamble says, "We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America." Waterboarding does not sound like Justice. In the late '80s, the US signed a UN convention against torture. Not only is America going back on her word, but she is also committing an international crime. A US binding law requires prosecution for those who authorize torture. That being said, waterboarding and other techniques are deviations from American ideals and values. The Government is one of the people, by the people, and for the people.
Zachary Roach
PSCI 100.04
Waterboarding and other controversial techniques most definitely deviate from American Ideals and values, If our government is unable to get the information they are seeking from people then they need to try something else out, we always seem to want to hurt people to make them talk. I’m not sure how the U.S is able to get away with the "Do as I say not as I do" they try to pull. Just doesn’t seem right to me. Absolutely anyone going against the law should be prosecuted whether they are American or not, it is still breaking the laws that were put into place for reasons OTHER than to be broken. As far as if the American people are told about the dirt that is being done I don’t think that it will make any difference because those that are in power can do what they wish, and I’m not so sure what the powerless can do about it.
ReplyDeleteMarChell DeShong PSCI 100.04
I don’t think that the U.S should use waterboarding against people because it’s just cruel. There probably are many other ways to get information without torturing someone. I mean what if the government gets the wrong person then they would be getting tortured and they didn’t even do anything. The U.S didn’t even like the torturing techniques when the Japanese did it so why should the U.S. be doing it now. The U.S probably keeps it a secret instead of telling the public because they know a lot of people would not agree with what they are doing.
ReplyDeleteAshley Mellott
PSCI 100.03
when it comes to acts of violence against America or for information to give us an edge in war, that advanced interrogation techniques are necessary. Interrogation, just questioning the enemy does not always work. The Geneva Convention, UCMJ, and Law of Armed Conflict prevent military members( without authorization) from preforming these techniques. however, those with secret clearance are taught to resist these types of interrogations to prevent giving any information besides name, rank, and serial number.
ReplyDeleteSo i believe that the enemy too has training to prevent information leakage. For this and many reasons i think that we should be doing more interrogations of the enemy, and have no remorse for possibly preventing injury to America or its citizens.
Cordova,Jacob PSCI100:05
I’m still not completely convinced as to where I stand when it comes to the issues of water boarding and other torturous techniques. There are plenty of reasons to be for or against extraordinary rendition issues. However, I do believe that the United States was very hypocritical when prosecuting Japanese soldier during World War II. Obviously, we were doing the same thing and continue to use torture as a threat today. Torturing a person is not, in any sense, morally right, point blank. On the other hand, the people who are convicted to tortuous techniques have done something extremely out of line to threaten our very own well-being in this country and the security of our country. I think that the grounds which the government pursues extraordinary rendition is very sketchy. Taking criminals out of the country is a way to sort of “sugar-coat” and hide the issue in a more political correct sense because “the rules don’t apply” elsewhere. If extraordinary rendition happens on a necessary basis for the well- being and security of our country, maybe it shouldn’t be kept such a secret. It’s very hypocritical for our country to do such things and also be an example for other countries.
ReplyDeleteCayce Martin, PSCI 100.04
War is any ugly, yet necessary function of the government in order to obtain peace. Although we would like to believe that our country would not participate in torture of other human beings it most likely has happened, does happen, and will continue to happen in order to maintain perceived dominance between rivaling nations. “Ignorance is bliss” and I believe this saying is perfect for the defense of the government hiding the gruesome aspects that go on behind closed doors. I am in no way supporting the amputation of limbs or intentional killing and taping of deaths in order send a message to the enemies; in fact I am totally against these forms of torture. However, if someone holds the secret of mass destruction to human lives and the only way to get that information is water boarding then I see no harm in it; to save larger numbers of people some extreme measures may need to be taken, especially when dealing with different cultures.
ReplyDeleteI think that there could be a time where waterboarding would be necessary, such as in an impending disaster, but at the same time, I believe that we are undermining American values when we commit these crimes. And since these are crimes, the people that authorized this should be punished. If you kidnapped and tortured someone, then you would be put in jail, despite trying to justify your acts because that person was a "suspected terrorist". There was a scene in "The Expendables" in which someone gets waterboarded, and I was absolutely shocked by what that looks like. It's completely inhumane, and if we are a democracy, there should be a way for the general public to bring these actions to an end.
ReplyDeleteRebecca Herbert, 100.05
This whole topic is crazy, the fact that it is even debatable is dim-witted! Clearly there is a reason that Japanese soldiers and officials were prosecuted and sentenced to death… because it is a war crime. Just like the Japanese soldiers and officials, US officials who authorize water boarding should also be prosecuted for breaking US and international law. What’s stupid is that fact that some people will justify what the US is doing to be "OK" when, we do it but not OK when other countries do. If it was wrong during the WWII why would it be "OK" now? What would have changed to justify it?
ReplyDeleteSusan Stout
PSCI 100.05
I believe that all types of torture should be illegal because it is inhumane and solves nothing. But realistically that will never happen because just like the old saying “if you don’t tell me I will force it out of you” will be used anywhere and everywhere as long as we accept having strong security and power as our number one goal. Any government will do what they can to force out information they need and want, not caring who they harm so they can build strength and intelligence through acting as a brute. Even though I do not like any of the tortures I do believe if it is to be done that yes it should be publicly known so then we as the people know how the government is acting and what requires them to go to these unnecessary extremes and why. Torture should be a global crime just as murder is about everywhere because it is a violent act that is inhumane.For what I have always known our country is strongly based on not only freedoms and liberties but on human rights very highly. But if that’s the case then we wouldn’t torture people, the fact is we torture them for those freedoms and rights because we only have them through security. I believe that information can be collected on a more humane fashion and we should be learning from our barbaric mistakes throughout history and try maybe negotiating instead of acting. I was water boarded at a spa once on accident and let me tell you, it is very freaky cause you can not breath and you feel as if you have swallowed the whole cloth and you cant see what is going on. It makes me fear the realities of how humane people really are and to what extent will our government go for intelligence over others while using our very own tax dollars to torture people even though the majority is against it.
ReplyDeleteKatie clevenger, 100.05
I definitely agree with what Katie said, as well as Theoni. I believe its very hypocritical for the United States to punish the Japanese in WWII for torture, and then use it now. I definitely have mixed emotions on the subject of torture though. I'd like to say it's inhumane and wrong and it shouldn't be allowed, but when I stop to think about how valuable information that could save lives can be gotten through force, I want to say "yeah, let's torture them to protect ourselves and the people who live here." But again, morally, torture is wrong. As a citizen of the U.S. I don't want to be blind to the actions my "democratic" government makes, but in some instances, I think it's necessary for the public to be kept relatively in the dark. If everyone knew about some of the very difficult things that our government has to deal with daily, people would live their lives in fear, when in reality, there isn't much caution that needs to be taken in our everyday lives. The difficult part is deciding how much information is too much information.
ReplyDelete-Jessica Meyers 100.05
I agree in many ways with Dee Pierce and Jessica Meyers above. However, while the Convention Against Torture is a legitimate document there are always, as Pierce said, gray areas. Technically, in a democracy, we the people trust that those representatives we elect to office will keep our best interests at heart. Torture, among many other secret governmental activities are generally kept out of the public eye for reasons of morality and exposure. The government takes part in many activities not limited to torture in secret for the mere well being of the country. Our human nature is to take these things such as torturing of war criminals, threats against our country, and spying on other countries way out of proportion if they are not kept as a governmental secret. This does not justify the torture of human beings in my eyes but since these acts are obviously taking place I believe the government has legitimate reasoning for keeping the activities secret. The majority of the population would not know how to handle some of the gruesome details and brash lengths our government has to go to in order to protect our country.
ReplyDeleteAs far as the act of torturing going against American ideals goes, that is another difficult question to answer bluntly. We hold ideals such as brotherhood and humanity very dear but we also hold ideals such as protection of our country by any means necessary dear as well. As I said above with this subject there are gray areas as well. Torture, while it can be cruel and against the laws of humanity can be an effective way to collect information that will protect the United States. A clear answer to this question can be very hard to come to.
Sheridan Webb PSCI 100.05
Water boarding, as mentioned has been around for a long time, it will never go away. A question will always be posed should we use it to get answers or is it immoral. I believe that we should use it. Since it is being kept secret, who knows how many lives are being saved by interrogating people who instinctively blurt out exactly what we need to know to keep Americans safe. Terrorism is at an all time high and they will do the same things to us if we happen to be captured. In peaceful times water boarding should be abandoned but in times like now it is a necessity for National Security. It should continue to be kept a secret because if it was common knowledge too many people would argue against it possibly resulting in further farm to the American public. People underestimate how effective interrogation is and how significant the outcomes are. The US has probably saved thousands of lives by water boarding and catching terrorists. That is something people will overlook at first but will realize after the fact if water boarding was made public. It should happen and will happen and it will be a secret for the better of our nation.
ReplyDeleteLevi McDonald PSCI 100.03
The known torture methods used in old wars and some still used today seem like horrible things but do we have another way to get the information we really want? I'm not sure if I agree with the methods used but I do think sometimes it's necessary. In wanting it to be known to the public, it already is we may not know who it's done to and every time it's done but we know it happens. I don't think I'd want to see it publicly displayed or broadcasted. I don't think most people need to see it and hope most people don't want to.
ReplyDeleteI think that the US is being very hypocritical. If during World War II they were prosecuting Japenese soldiers for torturing people, then they should not be doing it now. I think this should be known to everyone to make the public know what the government is capable of doing and what they will do. Why should they be able to do it now, but during World War II, the US military sentenced Japanese soldiers to death for the same thing?This makes no sense and makes the US very hypocritical. But being hypocrites is what the United States it probably known for.
ReplyDeleteLeigh Ann Nelson PSCI 100.03
Oh yeah section 100.05
ReplyDeleteIan Hickman 100.05
ReplyDeleteRather than causing excruciating pain we are causing fear and discomfort for the terrorists, therefore; I do not oppose the idea of this practice. There was no bones being broken, branding, burning, beating, cutting, dismemberment, electrocution,ect. in any way. There were almost always trained medical personnel present in the interrogations of the individuals in case of medical emergency. There are no lasting physical effects from what they did to the POW’s. To say that this was torture would have to change what happened to any other person that is considered torture to another category because this was nothing more than aggressive interrogation. Nothing in the Just War theory frowns upon Aggressive interrogation. I don’t believe that this method positively reflects American core values, therefore it should not be discussed publicly (much like the majority of military affairs in our country), but for terrorists that have been convicted and are surely guilty... I think they can get it. There is no chance they are doing this to someone that knows nothing, information can be gained from the terrorists by putting them under intense interrogation like this.
I agree with one of the other students who said “War is Ugly”. I understand that in times of war, there will be prisoners. I would like to think that there are other ways of getting important information from individuals other than torture. I also understand that in most cases people are willing to die before betraying their own country. I believe in a time of war when you have individuals who are aiming to harm the citizens within the United States we have the right to try to get the information from those individuals to prevent such actions. The government has a duty to protect the citizens and if they have the information of a known terrorist and learn of a plot to attack the United States they need to do what it takes to protect the people. The debate here is not whether we like the idea of torture or that torture would be induced on the citizens of the United States. Terrorist plotting and helping to implement destruction to the United States do not have the same rights as a United States citizen. The same people who have a problem with the tactics are the same people who would get upset with the government if they did not get the important information and something happened to the United States. I personally do not like the fact that people are being tortured, but I also don’t like the idea that people are plotting to kill and destroy the American population.
ReplyDeleteKaren Martin PSCI 100.04
I believe that waterboarding is a good method that the United States used against the terroist. It was a way to get them to talk. It was a punishment bt it wasnt so cruel that they took their lives away. I feel that the United States government should keep the methods a secret because you dont want the word to get out. Once it is out the terriost will know and stay away. Secrecy is not a good thing to do to your citizens but in this type of situation its best for them not to know. I am not for the waterboarding but in this type of situation i'm all about bettering the knowledge of our government.
ReplyDeleteMegan Long
PSCI 100.03
I don't believe that any form of physical torture should ever be used. Unfortunately, the US does utilize such torture methods. The fact that we use torture is often kept from the general public's eye and is done outside of the US's legal enforcement. I think that new methods of interigation need to be developed. While torture does produce wanted results, it is not a humane way of handling situations. By utilizing torture methods, we are doing to people exactly what we are trying to get people to stop doing to others. Don't get me wrong...pshycological torture should not be employed either. As a country, and within the lines of what we stand for, the US needs to stop using torture and come up with new methods, then even share those with the World.
ReplyDeleteIt is scary to think that the government did and maybe still using this techniques and others. I feel that this technique is not right and inhumane. The only time I think it might be acceptable would be if it is used on a criminal. The government officials should be punished for torturing people this way. I don't think the death pentalty but maybe using that method on them. I don't see what satisfication they get out of suffocating people. I feel like its not a secret anymore and that most people basically know now about waterboarding or walling. There may be alot of secrets that we don't know about the government but I think this one is out of the bag.
ReplyDeleteTorture is used by many governments, including ours. Although we do not hear about it ever day, it is till out there. These torture methods are vital for certain situations, althouh they are very terrible methods to use. Torture, however, is used on others aside from the enemy in which we do not very well know about. This s very wrong, considering we do not know why they are being tortured. Like Christina said, the Japanese let their people know what they are doing and why. The US does not. Why are US citizens being tortured by our very own government? The answer to this question is one of which we may never know since our government is filled with so much secrecy.
ReplyDeletePamela Smoot PSCI 100.04
I believe that the United States is being hypocritical by using waterboarding and should not use it. In 1984, the totalitarian government used these types of techniques against the people and I believe thatthese methods should not be used in any type of government, especially in a democracy like America. Waterboarding is unfair to those who in reality have no knowledge of what they are being questioned about. The only case in which waterboarding should be used is when it is known that an individual knows something that could potentially result in deaths of innocent Americans. I think that the government should indeed tell us what is going on behind closed doors and make us aware of what kind of techniques they are using to attain information because of the possibility that it is going against our beliefs and ideals.
ReplyDeleteJenna Peck PSCI 100.04
Violence and conflict are two things that I don’t like at all, and would like to stay away from, but torture in such a manner in my eyes is violence as well. It inflicts pain and suffering. The fact that the technique has been used for a long time doesn’t give it any more reason to use it. Using the technique goes against a lot of what America says it stands for. In fact it is quite contradictory of America to prosecute Japanese soldiers and officials and sentence them to death and then later on down the years use the same techniques.
ReplyDeleteSofia Khan PSCI 100.05
I am slightly torn on the subject. I do not believe in torturing others to get what you want. However, in a terrorism situation I tend to feel slightly different. If the lives of millions of people are at stake, then yes. By all means go ahead and do what you have to in order to save the country. In the case of waterboarding you should ask yourself, what scenario would you rather have: millions of men, women, and children at high risk for attack or one terrorist that did NOT die and just inhaled a bit of water...
ReplyDeleteHeather Reynolds
PSCI 100.04
I agree completly with Heather Reynolds comment. I mean when it comes down to who we know is a terrorist and trying to attack our country and like she said kill millions of Americans then yes i feel tourture is needed but if it is just an innocent crime then no there is no need for a horrible crime like waterboarding.
ReplyDeleteKasey Mercier
100.03
Torture is something that I feel no one really takes lightly. Obviously if you are going to torture someone in a time of war, with something like waterboarding; the person in question must have done something horrific, or knows something about some horrific act against the country. I fully believe that American soldiers do not just walk up to innocent people and take them captive to torture them for fun. I understand that torture should be a last resort, or to some people, not an option; but at the same time how is the military supposed to obtain information? I highly doubt if an American soldier takes a terrorist out to a nice steak dinner and asks them for the information in return, it would be given. Sometimes forceable action, even torture, is a necessary evil in times of war.
ReplyDeleteSarah Jeffries, PSCI 100.05
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI thought there was something in our constitution that said something about outlawing cruel and unusual punishment. So why does our Government have torturing techniques, such as waterboarding, that are seen by most of the population as cruel and unusual? It doesn't make any sense to me. Why does America always say they are the most free and democratic country, while at the same time we use the same techniques for torturing that are used by Totalitarian regimes such as North Korea? I think that if we want waterboarding to end, we need to take a step back and observe ourselves and revaluate our value system.
ReplyDeleteRoss Tamaccio 100.03
Waterboarding is a form of torture, and torture isn't seen as being appropriate. In some cases, it is neccessary though and the government officials should not be prosecuted. By ways of torture the government can find out secret information that is neccessary. They should not be kept secret from the public. They do have a right to know.
ReplyDeleteAlicia Watts 100.04
To be honest, I believe that we, the United States of America, are indeed being hypocritical. Since we did kill the Japanese for doing "water boarding," then we should not be doing it either. If we went against what they were doing, then why are we doing the exact same thing? We shouldn't be, we should stick to our image of our government doing good for the citizens and protecting us in other ways. Even though we still do it, it is better that it is kept secret from the public because it is better for everyone to be oblivious on to what our goverment is doing in order to protect us.
ReplyDeleteAlaina Meserole PSCI 100.05
I believe there is some good and some bad to the water boarding technique. After reading through a few of the comments I agree with the United States being somewhat hypocritical in that they persecuted the Japanese for doing it but then we decided we are going to perform the same actions they did. It seems a little odd. At the same time though, I realize that these techniques are usually only done on a need to know basis, or if there is something very important to find out. Yes, we as Americans probably don't know everything that is going on behind closed doors with things like this but it obviously isn't to big of a problem if there hasn't been much talk about it. Like Sarah said, sometimes forceable action is necessary to obtain information or keep people safe.
ReplyDeleteAnissa Myers PSCI 100:04
Should torture be used is a debate that has been going on for years. Torture was, is, and will be used. Whether its in attempts to acquire pertinent information or used as a means to ensure safety from certain individuals or groups it is something that every country utilizes. The question is should various torture techniques and methods used by the government be public knowledge? I believe that the publication of various tools used by the government undermines the effectiveness, and allows informatition to be public knowledge not only to Americans but anyone else that might be interested. I believe this can pose a prblem; our government is entrusted with keeping America safe, and I believe if the wrong information were to leak out in the midst of all the other information it would weaken our country and make us susceptable to enemies.
ReplyDeleteI believe water boarding is a necessary evil. The United States may of prosecuted Japanese individuals for water boarding during times of war, but I am sure that was most likely just one of the many things they had done to prisoners as evident by this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FlPBJLdU_qc&oref=http%3A%2F%2Fau.answers.yahoo.com%2Fquestion%2Findex%3Fqid%3D20100529222619AAVKRPr&has_verified=1&oref=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fverify_age%3Fnext_url%3Dhttp%253A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%253Fv%253DFlPBJLdU_qc%2526oref%253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fau.answers.yahoo.com%25252Fquestion%25252Findex%25253Fqid%25253D20100529222619AAVKRPr%2526has_verified%253D1. For those out there that wish to complain about how evil water boarding is, I’d like to remind you how many worse forms there are for you. The United States captures a prisoner, they water board them to retrieve viable information that could not be found otherwise. If you get captured in the Middle East, they cut off limbs and behead you. In WWII United States POW’s would routinely be tortured to death, starved, mutilated, have their nails ripped out, their genitalia cut off, etc. I wish we lived in a world of gumdrops and butterflies where every human being got along, but the world does not work that way. When you have an enemy that has vowed to kill every man, woman and child that does not convert to their beliefs and is willing to fight until death to accomplish their goal (such as the Islamic extremists), you have to do what you have to do. If water boarding a POW means it will stop a suicide bomber from taking out a school, bus, etc, then it is a necessary evil.
ReplyDeleteMatt Santmier. PSCI 100.03
I agree with Theoni Kontos. The US officials should not have gotten away from prosecution of the crimes that the Japanese officials were prosecuted for. Mostly because its not fair, but it is also not setting a good example to our nation and other nations. Just because torture is effective doesn't mean it is legitimate. I'm sure man people would agrees that torture is inhuman, especially torture on a mental basis.
ReplyDeleteChristopher White PSCI 100.03
Extraordinary redition of suspected threats to national security is a direct violation of the U.S constitution in the sense that the government is being the judge and the jury and not allowing the suspect to go through the constisutional right of due process. Some could argue that this is only to keep our country safe, and the constitution is always open to interpretation but the fact that our country revolves so mechanically around the constitution, for the government to go ahead and take due proccess and throw it out the window and detain anybody, for any amount of time and do essentially anything they want to them is not okay even if these people are looked at as a faction to society.
ReplyDeleteDillon Berger psci 100.4
I feel like we are going against everything we believe in here in America by water boarding. I agree with Dillon when he said it was a violation of the U.S Constitution. The suspect could be innocent and they don't even check that out. They just assume, then innocent people get hurt or killed. We may be doing this stuff to make our country a safer place, but our government and national security should make sure that we are punishing the people that DESERVE to be punished.
ReplyDeleteShayna Landis 100.03
Waterboarding is torture and by that meaning it is unconsitional which also makes it unamerican. That is why I believe water boarding should not be practiced at all in the United States. I am sure the government has its reasons for imprisoning certain foreign citizens and the own US citizens without due process. I do not agree that it is right, but it probably is needed to keep everyone safe. I believe that if the public ever found out the the US did waterboard many would say that it is important to the country even though it is wrong. I feel there are better ways to protect the country from threats, but water boarding can be an effective way for certain cases even though it is wrong.
ReplyDeleteSam Beatty
100.04
No, i do not believe that torture is always unconstitutional. In some circumstances water-boarding and other techniques can be acceptable. Such as when a prisoner is taking into custody and they obviously know information that the torturer needs. Im not saying that all types of torture should be accepted or constitutional because that is not what i think at all. Since, America is completely against any type of torture, it is very hypocritical for Americans to use torture techniques. This is why i feel America should be more open to torture, but not all techniques. some should be more acceptable then others. Water-boarding is dangerous if the person doing the water boarding does not know what they are doing. If they do know what they are doing it does not seem to be that dangerous, its not going to kill anyone, it just makes the victim panic. Which will eventually make a prisoner give up information. There are some instances where it is acceptable and some when it is not.
ReplyDeleteI believe that waterboarding is necessary in certain situations. I believe the government has the right to torture someone to find out useful information to protect our country. I don't think it's something that should be talked about because it is unconstitutional, but sometimes torture is the best way. I watched a movie that had SamualL. Jackson in it, but i can't think of the name. In the movie he was called in to help the military find out from this muslim man where he planted the bombs around the US. He was waterboarded, burned, his nails were cut off, he saw his wife being murdered in front of him. These may be drastic measures, but hurting one person isn't as bad as killing thousands.
ReplyDeleteI totally agree with what the first three people have said on this post. I agree that it is hypocritical to what we are doing since other soliders were charged for this very act, and as citizens we should be more aware of what our government is doing. There are better ways to protect our country from threats, and I do not believe that what the government is doing is to keep "us" safe. I also think that there are other issues just like the issue of water boarding that the government is keep from us.
ReplyDeleteAmy Sultner 1000.03
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeletedo not agree with waterboarding. I think that there are multiple of ways that we can get answers out of people that we do not have to use this or torture them. We i think should know about things such as this. I think that there are plenty of better ways to stop threats from happening. I think that there are many of other things that we need to know about that the government keeps from us.
ReplyDeleteCourtney Owens 100.03
The hypocrisy of the United States actions after World War II is undeniable. However the real question is are we hypocrites today for reinstating water-boarding or are we hypocrites for executing the Japanese generals for something we later did at home? Either way we are guilty of punishing someone for something we advocate. But that does not address the morality of the issue.
ReplyDeleteTorture as a means of interrogation is not a practice unique to our country. When we send our forces to foreign countries they know the risks involved with being captured. That is why we train them to endure different forms of interrogation and teach them how to withhold vital information.
Both sides know that information can often be the key to winning a war or protecting innocent civilians. That is why interrogation techniques are developed to obtain that information. They may not be pleasant to the POW’s but when lives are at stake tough decisions have to be made.
Unfortunately, in war the fight often continues outside of the battlefield. One side tries to obtain information by developing better interrogation techniques. The other side then tries to learn these techniques and protect vital information by preparing its soldiers.
However, these forms of interrogation should never be unnecessarily cruel or extreme. An ordinary enemy soldier should not be subjected to methods that threaten his life or cause unbearable quantities of pain. Therefore any means of interrogation needs to be subject to some sort of limit. There needs to be specific situations in which interrogation can be used and at what levels. Of course the repercussions of failing to retrieve this information should play a major role in the intensity allowed in these interrogations. The personal crimes of the person interrogated should also be examined. There need to be rules and regulations. Thus the ultimate responsibility lies with us, the American people to protest any injustices against human rights when we discover them and prevent such injustices form occurring again.
-Aaron M. Ladd
PSCI 100.05
Torture is a double-edged sword. Its a possibility that someone witholding information will give it up after such processes. But its also possible that someone without the actual information will give false information, or simply tell the interrogater what they want to hear, in order to cease the pain.
ReplyDeleteI believe torturing someone for answers is wrong. No matter what nobody deserves to be tortured. There are many other ideas and strategies to get an individual to talk. Why make ourselves look bad by torturing? Although I feel the government does things to maintain their role as being forceful. This is not what American is about at all. Everyone believes that America is the perfect place, but only if they knew the secrets I wouldn't doubt that they would change their mind.
ReplyDeleteLacie Sirk PSCI 100.05